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Feature #681980

civ2civ3: use Mining_Pct for oil well, and Irrigation_Pct for desert flood.

Added by David Fernandez (bard) 4 months ago. Updated 2 months ago.

Status:
Closed
Priority:
Normal
Category:
Rulesets
Target version:
Start date:
Due date:
% Done:

0%

Estimated time:

Description

Replaces the effect Output_Inc_Tile by Mining_Pct (for oil well), and by Irrigation_Pct (for desert with river). This way the output is shown properly in the tile help (holding middle mouse button). It seems the bonuses from Output_Inc_Tile are not shown here, and I find it confusing in these two cases.

I think the patch does not change the gameplay, but I'm not completely sure. I tested it with current trunk (v3.1).
I'll upload later a patch for v2.6 where Oasis is a resource, not an extra.

civ2civ3-output_inc_to_pct-Trunk.patch (4.35 KB) civ2civ3-output_inc_to_pct-Trunk.patch David Fernandez (bard), 2017-07-10 02:26 AM
civ2civ3-output_inc_to_pct-S2_6.patch (4.36 KB) civ2civ3-output_inc_to_pct-S2_6.patch David Fernandez (bard), 2017-07-10 05:39 PM

Related issues

Related to Freeciv - Bug #694736: Middle-click popup and start position selection ignore effects like Output_Add_TileClosed

Related to Freeciv - Bug #695979: civ2civ3: Desert with river should require irrigation to get extra foodClosed

Blocks Freeciv - Task #694704: civ2civ3: introduce new features for 2.6Closed

History

#2 Updated by Jacob Nevins 4 months ago

This way the output is shown properly in the tile help (holding middle mouse button). It seems the bonuses from Output_Inc_Tile are not shown here

I've been meaning to have a go at fixing this for a while; it ought to be possible to detect Output_Inc_Tile effects that are not city-dependent, and get them included in the tile info popup. (That would be a new ticket though.)

#3 Updated by Jacob Nevins 3 months ago

  • Blocks Task #694704: civ2civ3: introduce new features for 2.6 added

#4 Updated by Jacob Nevins 3 months ago

I'm hoping bug #694736 will make this patch unnecessary.

#5 Updated by Jacob Nevins 3 months ago

  • Related to Bug #694736: Middle-click popup and start position selection ignore effects like Output_Add_Tile added

#6 Updated by David Fernandez (bard) 3 months ago

Jacob Nevins wrote:

I'm hoping bug #694736 will make this patch unnecessary.

I'll try to test that patch. Thank you.

However, I have noticed another differences between Output_Inc_Tile and Mining_Pct/Irrigation_Pct, where I'd prefer the later, so I still vote to apply the patch if possible (maybe for 3.0 instead of 2.6).

1) Output_Inc_Tile is not taken into account for railroad bonuses, while Mining_Pct is.
If we keep Output_Inc_Tile, then there is a minor error in the readme of civ2civ3 where it says that max production of glaciers is 3 (when it is actually 2).
If we apply this patch (using Mining_Pct), then max production of glaciers is 3 (Mine + Oil well + Railroad), and I prefer this value because the max output (0/3/0) would be more balanced compared to other bad lands (like swamps 3/0/0). I find this balance important, because once terraforming is available, these two terrains (glaciers and swamps) become the prefered tiles to be terraformed first.

This point could also affect deserts with bonus resources and railroad, but I don't find it important for gameplay.

2) With Output_Inc_Tile, flood Desert is practically the same than Plains, and there is almost no reason to keep them as 2 different terrains.
Using Irrigation_Pct, flood Desert would give less food than Plains until they are irrigated, so both terrains would be a bit more unique.

#7 Updated by Marko Lindqvist 3 months ago

  • Status changed from New to Resolved
  • Target version set to 2.6.0-beta1

#8 Updated by Marko Lindqvist 2 months ago

  • Status changed from Resolved to Closed
  • Assignee set to Marko Lindqvist

#9 Updated by Jacob Nevins 2 months ago

2) With Output_Inc_Tile, flood Desert is practically the same than Plains, and there is almost no reason to keep them as 2 different terrains.
Using Irrigation_Pct, flood Desert would give less food than Plains until they are irrigated, so both terrains would be a bit more unique.

I'm not sure I understand this comment. This change seems to have made Desert+River more like Plains, not less.

Comparing S2_5 (that uses Output_Inc_Tile) with S2_6 (now using Irrigation_Pct), experimentally:

S2_5:           -       Irrig   Farm
Desert          0/1/0   1/1/0   1/1/0
Desert+River    0/1/1   2/1/1   3/1/1
Desert+Oasis    3/1/0   4/1/0   6/1/0
Desert+River+O  3/1/1   4/1/1   6/1/1

Plains          1/1/0   2/1/0   3/1/0
Plains+River    1/1/1   2/1/1   3/1/1

S2_6:           -       Irrig   Farm
Desert          0/1/0   1/1/0   1/1/0
Desert+River    1/1/1   2/1/1   3/1/1
Desert+Oasis    3/1/0   4/1/0   6/1/0
Desert+River+O  3/1/1   4/1/1   6/1/1

Plains          1/1/0   2/1/0   3/1/0
Plains+River    1/1/1   2/1/1   3/1/1

So Desert+River is now practically indistinguishable from Plains. In particular, unimproved Desert+River already gives 1 food (where before it gave 0); and irrigation only gives an increase of 1 food (contradicting the help).

Is this what you intended?

Output_Inc_Tile is "Add amount to each worked tile that already has at least 1 output."
Irrigation_Pct is "make tile behave as though it were irrigated", not "modify effect of irrigation special". (It is now the means by which the irrigation special does anything.)

Perhaps you meant for Irrigation_Pct to also be conditionalised on presence of irrigation special as well as river? (Although, if you do that, I don't see any functional difference from what went before.)

#10 Updated by David Fernandez (bard) 2 months ago

You are right, it is the opposite that I said.
My desired result is the one described in the terrain helptext, not the one in the readme. The patch is wrong.

Then, I vote to revert that part of the patch, or to make Irrigation_Pct conditionalised on presence of irrigation special as well as river, as you say. I personally find the later more intuitive to understand (building irrigation will yield two extra food).

I made a patch here Bug #695979.

#11 Updated by Jacob Nevins 2 months ago

  • Related to Bug #695979: civ2civ3: Desert with river should require irrigation to get extra food added

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